Celebrity Interviewing 102: Moderator Interview Styles (Part D - Jenelle Riley)

One cannot discuss celebrity interviewing without Jenelle Riley. She is (in my humble opinion) one of the best! She can talk to anyone, making them feel welcome, special, and like a real person who just happens to be famous.

According to her bio page on Variety’s website, she is the Deputy Awards and Features Editor, has won two Emmy Awards for “Actors on Actors” (a series I will discuss more in an upcoming post) as well as winning awards for her own short films. As an entertainment journalist she has covered EVERYTHING! Her published articles range from ranking an actor’s best performances to award season predictions to in-depth profiles, and of course, regular movie reviews. In a world with so many click-bait titles, Jenelle refuses to pander so low to readers. Instead, she gives them straightforward phrasing and yet still intriguing descriptions. You don’t have to read them twice just to figure out what she’s going to be writing about, and you don’t need to worry about that one item that is so completely wrong there are 100 outraged and disagreeing comments – which the writer was fully aware would cause that kind of controversy. (Looking at you Buzzfeed.)

Additionally, Jenelle has been one of the few preferred hosts of the SAG and then SAG-AFTRA Foundation Conversations series since 2012. And now that it is hundreds of interviews later, she has become even more of a tireless powerhouse whose passion for the industry has not waned. You can tell in every video interview her guests enjoy speaking with her. Perhaps only other than on James Lipton’s and Sean Evans’ in-depth researched interview shows, she is whom guests share unique memories from their professional lives that you wouldn’t hear elsewhere.

Choosing my favorite career retrospective interviews of hers to examine for this blog post would be impossible. Among the prolific diverse list of videos available on YouTube are all of Hollywood’s elite. So instead, I decided to study every 5^th(-ish) video on the search results list, which in (year release order) are:

1. Leonardo DiCaprio from 2014
2. Michael B. Jordan from 2018
3. Michelle Yeoh from 2019
4. Nicole Kidman from 2021
5. Jake Gyllenhaal from 2013 and then from 2016 to do a compare/contrast

…And, wow, this turned out to be a really great list!

All of these took place at the SAG-AFTRA Los Angeles’ office screening theatre for an audience full of member performers, except for Nicole Kidman’s which was part of the Conversations-At-Home interviews done during the pandemic. The core goals of these in-person moderated interviews were to give high profile performers an opportunity to discuss their careers at length in a room with other professional actors who could appreciate the unique methods and experiences of their craft. And in turn, the professional actors who are still working towards their big break, get the opportunity to hear the celebrity actor talk about their own struggles in the business, methods of preparation, and even how they handle audition rejections. These conversations also provide celebrity actors a break from the typical interview cycles of questions that need to be part puff-piece, part-promotion, and part-gossip. With Jenelle Riley, and the other hand-picked moderators at the helm of these interviews, the actors will be treated professionally and as valuable mentors with lessons for the audience. But, by no means are these interviews boring. There is plenty of light-hearted banter, a lot of funny stories shared, and some audience interaction that can’t be had other than when between peers.

Jenelle always welcomes the celebrity guest to the stage with a warmly written summary of how impressive their credits are, pointing out their celebrated careers, range of roles, or for the new celebrities, how much of a breakout star they are and what impact they’re having on the industry. When the guest walks on stage, there is a strong round of applause, and the interview quickly gets underway. In the videos watched for this blog and from those I recall previously watching, Jenelle structures her interviews a few ways.

Most often, she goes with the “This is Your Life” format moving chronologically up to the current project and what they want to do next. Or she may book-end the interview with the current project, go backwards, and then ends-up at the present. And usually, there’s one project they both return to speaking about because it’s that important and/or that recent. She asks some more general questions to get the conversation going, to see how different guests’ answers differ, and to confirm or clarify something she came across in her research. But through the interviews, she will catch-on to something the guest is telling a story about and push the topic or thought further, and she always finds a way to make a kind-hearted joke to get everyone laughing! Jenelle always comes to an interview prepared, confident, and genuine.

This post took me longer than anticipated to put together and needed to be edited down (a lot) and it's still super long (as always). So I highly encourage you dear patient reader to read through the below highlighted exchanges but click the YouTube links for the full interviews. These are great to watch so you can see the actors look and behave more as themselves in a relaxed setting, but you can just as easily listen to them like podcasts.

Leonardo DiCaprio - 2014

When Jenelle gets on stage, she is welcomed by the audience’s clapping but she quickly says, “Oh, save your applause, trust me.” But for what you’ll see in the interview, she’s very deserving too. (At the time Jenelle was the Associate Features Editor at Variety, so she’s been promoted since!) Her introduction of Leo is a paragraph’s worth summary of his career that could open his published (auto)biography. “This is an actor who continues to make bold choices and deliver outstanding performances in a wide variety of genres.” And, realizing the gravity of being the one interviewing him, “I am so honored, so pleased, and so intimidated to welcome Leonardo DiCaprio!” Everyone laughed and clapped.

Not only is their interview still considered one of the most comprehensive interviews he has done to date, but his stories have been repeatedly picked-up by other entertainment journalists ever since. Her interview is structured into four parts: (1) his growing up in Los Angeles, auditioning as a child actor, and when he worked on Growing Pains (1991), (2) his 90s era independent films, his work on Titanic (1997), and becoming a teen heartthrob through the early 2000s, (3) his first set of collaborations with Spielberg and Scorsese such as Catch Me If You Can, Gangs of New York, The Aviator, The Departed, and Shutter Island (all released from 2002 to 2010), and then (4) his second set of major collaborations through the present (2014) with Scorsese, Tarantino, and Christopher Nolan and Baz Luhrmann such as Inception, J. Edgar, Django, Unchained, along with The Great Gatsby and The Wolf of Wall Street. As Leo is considered one of Hollywood’s more private actors and rarely discusses his personal life – despite when it’s sometimes captured by paparazzi pictures – his hour plus time with Jenelle is revealing yet also relaxed.

Although she moved from past to present with ease, her initial question asks how he learned of his recent Oscar nomination for The Wolf of Wall Street (2013). It’s a great starter because it allows them to discuss his long history of work being recognized and how he can say he’s seen the “ebb and flow” of the industry’s changes, and from seeing how many different kinds of films there have been getting financed, making for so many outstanding performances, he’s “really excited just to be in the conversation this year.”

When asking about his early career, Leo said he was incredibly grateful to Growing Pains for writing him out of the show early so that he could do the film This Boy’s Life (1993). Jenelle reacts like a piece of the mysterious puzzle to his character is finally revealed: “That’s why you were re-adopted by your father, it’s all coming together for me now!” And Leo replies with an appreciated little laugh at her fandom. He also took the opportunity to talk more about his friendship with Toby Maguire, of how even though auditions were really competitive between actors, they made a promise to each other that whoever got the lead in This Boy’s Life, they’d get the other a role in it too! Considering the lead would be working with Robert DeNiro, it’s a gift to help make that opportunity happen between friends. Leo goes on to say it was that experience that taught him the fundamentals of acting and how to behave professionally on set. Director Michael Caton-Jones especially had to tell Leo not to goof around like a teenage boy between takes (with Toby) because “an actor prepares”. Jenelle of course acknowledged that they’d work together again twenty years later on The Great Gatsby, playing Nick Carraway and Jay Gatsby; they both got to share the screen in equally compelling roles.  

Jenelle moves the interview along to cover The Basketball Diaries and Total Eclipse (both 1995) – which opened-up the conversation to discuss, “What attracts you to (playing) real people?” He succinctly answers, “I suppose when you’re reading a screenplay and you’re moved by something that happens in it, to know that it happened in reality, you just get a different sort of emotional attachment to it and often times peoples’ lives are so much more surreal and interesting and obscure than something a writer can create from their imagination…I look to history to find interesting characters…people’s motivations and choices, they puzzle me all the time…”. Then he dived more into how happy he was getting to do the research for The Aviator (2004). He speaks of his work on this project with the utmost pride throughout the interview; details and anecdotes popping-up in relation to his other roles.

Leo’s career took off into the celebrity stratosphere first with Baz Luhrmann’s Romeo + Juliet (1996) and then of course more so with James Cameron’s Titanic (1997). Jenelle was bold enough to ask him to confirm if his first scene with Kate Winslet was him drawing a nude Rose;  which he couldn’t be sure of – but then used it to instead discuss their chemistry as being part of why the movie was such a huge success. She keeps it going with, “Was that instantaneous or something you worked at?” Leo answered that they just so easily “got along” not just for how much they respected each other’s work ethic but also for the time they spent together working on set for the “months and months”. They bonded over their shared experiences and have been close friends ever since. When Titanic was released, Leo says he had trouble grasping what all of the box office numbers meant, but there was a definite shift in feeling how people received it: going from a $300 million disaster to the highest grossing “phenomenon”.

Leo’s work from then on kept proving how natural and fantastic an actor he is in his own right in the same way that Robert DeNiro and Daniel Day Lewis are revered: as a Hollywood  and international superstar veteran even by the age of 40. And as a reminder, Jenelle’s interview took place before his even more honored credits in The Revenant (2015) and Once Upon a Time in Hollywood (2019). With Leo’s anticipated Don’t Look Up (2021) and future film releases, he will be one of the film industry’s and cinema history’s greatest of all time!

Their conversation closed on discussing (as I mentioned above) The Wolf of Wall Street. When Jenelle asked about the crazy “quaaludes scene”, Leo says that he spoke with Scorsese: “to feel to me like how a segment of Goodfellas felt with the cocaine…the whole movie should have that energy…up the ante of that…us as artists saying this is the film we’re gonna make, it’s gonna be crude and hedonistic…reflective of the culture around us and this world…this is the director’s vision.” She makes a joke-question, “But as an actor you’re reading the script, ‘Jordan has a lit candle in his ass’ is there any part of this you were hesitating to do?” “Of course. We were encouraged from the onset, anything goes…like the Roman Empire in a giant Hieronymus Bosch painting…”. While filming, he and Jonah Hill needed to remind each other they were still human beings.

Unfortunately, they ran out of time allotted and had to say their good-byes.

This interview video has a running time of 1 hour and 11 minutes, without ad breaks or film clips, and has garnered over 2.1 million views. This is an incredible stat! It goes to show not only are people happy to watch and listen to Leo just sit and talk for that long uninterrupted, but you have to give credit to Jenelle for keeping his and the audience’s attention by keeping their conversation going, the interesting questions coming, and those momentary interjections of enthusiasm to his answers. From my parsing through the comments (there are thousands for this video) they gave her high compliments for her “no bullshit questions” not just for the archive’s sake, but as a fan too. One comment even suggests she get an Oscar (which was supported by 500 likes)!

Michael B. Jordan – 2018

Jenelle welcomed Michael B. Jordan to the stage with, “I am so so thrilled to be here…this is an actor, producer, all-around superhero and superhero nemesis…who consistently delivers complex charismatic performances…(and lists his awards).” He walks on stage, giving her a light kiss on the cheek and plays with a toothpick in his mouth, emphasizing that “charismatic” quality. In one of her most unique fun/funny ways to start talking about an actor’s career, she says, “I was just thinking that we’ve just entered a period of time where now the other guy is the other Michael Jordan!” “…I’ll take that, that’s been my goal for a long time, since I was a kid getting bullied on the basketball court…I would always get the Michael Jordan jokes for sure.” This is in reference to the legendary Chicago Bulls basketball player who also has some acting-producing credits. Even though for a minute he considered changing his professional name, he decided to keep his own, by adding the B initial.

And this leads into her first question, “How did you get your SAG card?” He initially reacted with a joke about how “you can buy it now?” The audience erupted in laughter and Jenelle needed to say, “Well, you can be Taft-Hartley’d…I don’t know what you mean by ‘buy’.” And jokes if he bought it “from some guy downtown (Los Angeles)?” He had trouble remembering because he’s been working since a kid, doing advertisement print and commercials, and someone from the audience said it could be for his television show work (which would have been with AFTRA before the unions merged), but for SAG, he settled on his working with Keanu Reeves on Hardball (2001).

As Michael got a little older, he’d gotten roles and background work on more mature content shows like HBO’s The Sopranos until he landed a principal role on The Wire (2002). Jenelle asks, “Were you old enough to watch the shows you were doing?” His parents let him, at least to “see my-self on screen…but they weren’t strict parents. But probably shouldn’t have.” She continues the line-of-thought with asking a more general question, “What point did you want to do this for a career?” He answered, “For a long time it was about getting out of school…taking the train back and forth to The City (NYC)…But right when I got killed off on The Wire…getting lost in the character…playing that moment.” That was when he felt it was his “first time in character.”

Moving on to talk about his time working on the soap opera All My Children (from 2003 to 2006), Jenelle wanted Michael to confirm if “it’s true you’d replaced Chadwick Boseman?” Even though it’s not something he prefers talking about, he and Chadwick have “talked about it and had some good laughs.” Easing the conversation back to his comfort level, Jenelle says, “Soap operas are like the best training ground, you have to learn so many lines in so short a time.” Michael says that working in that method helped him with “fear of not being prepared on set. I’ll never be in that position again.” She asked if his character Reggie experienced anything extreme because those shows can include crazy storylines like amnesia, evil twins, “demonic possession”, aliens, etc. But Reggie was “like the stereotypical troubled Black teen who got the gun at one point, robbing a construction site for copper pipping.” And while thinking back to those years, he said, “I think I lost my virginity on that set,” to which Jenelle quickly retorted, “Your character?” “Yeah, my character”, Michael giving a laugh and wink to the audience.

Part of his career after leaving the soap opera was finding his next steady job. He moved to Los Angeles and worked as a guest on numerous shows, but “never had a real/proper pilot season.” He’d go from job-to-job earning enough to afford rent instead of moving back to New Jersey. It’s an all too familiar tale of what most actors endure in their journeys. “That was the game, go for broke, until you can put together a string of projects where you can actually save money.” She took the opportunity to ask an audience question (but something she would have asked too) about how he handled “rejection from auditions?” He didn’t take it too seriously when he was younger because of having other things to pay attention to, and didn’t have a “legit stage mom”, but the pool of actors for roles he was going after was so small that he’d know who’d get the role if he didn’t and as a friend be happy for them.

Michael’s career started to hit its upwards stride with the television shows, Friday Night Lights and Parenthood (from 2009 and to 2011), both created by Jason Katims. He realized that relationships matter because when you have that rapport, you are more likely to work on their other projects. He started getting recognized by viewers. “All the right people were watching those shows, the wives of the executives…Every show that I did counted for something…positioned me for the next blessing…withstood test of time.”

But his film role in Chronicle (2012) with another newcomer Dane DeHaan, showed he could do more than television, and was proof that his strategy for going after roles initially written for Caucasian males was working. “I just wanted to reverse engineer that…(Chronicle’s team) believed in me…”. Jenelle was really impressed by that movie because of how “what you can do with an idea even if you don’t have the biggest budget.” Michael added, “Understanding that…do a movie that scale for that amount of money, and make X amount of dollars. Budget and perspective matters but not really, you can make a lot with a little. This further moves into his role in Fruitvale Station (2013), as the beginning of his collaborations with Ryan Coogler.

Jenelle says it “one of my favorite movies of all time.” In a space of his peers who understand what it means to be type-cast, to be underrated, but also having to take on the responsibility of portraying a real person, it’s great their conversation here gives Michael an extended time frame to talk about the project uninterrupted by commercial breaks or worrying it’d be too deep for television talk shows to turn into soundbites.

Jenelle: I heard that this was made for under $1million, is that true?

Michael: That was a true indie.

Jenelle: You shot in 20 days?

Michael: Yeah, so much fun making movies with friends…lots of rehearsal, and the time we had to flesh out characters…very frustrated at that time about Treyvon Martin.

Jenelle: The day Fruitvale Station hit theatres, they released George Zimmerman.

Michael: We were at a Q&A, the verdict came in while we were walking on stage. I got a chance to break the news to the audience. It was a heavy moment…Actors and the voice you have, feeling comfortable speaking out…best way to do it is through my work…vent on screen…It was the project I needed, I wanted to know if I can carry a film…curious to see if I can do…and express myself as a Black man on screen…Chance for us to shine a light on that character, shine a light on those people that don’t have a voice anymore.

Ryan approached Michael with the project (his USC thesis) and having just come out of the Sundance Lab workshopping the script, saying “I think you’re a movie star, let’s go show the world!” They became close friends so quickly and were able to connect working together so easily.

Even before starting with filming, Ryan was also thinking about the Creed (2015) franchise. “Let’s make as many movies as we can together.” Jenelle interjects with them being the new DeNiro/Scorsese team, as a (kind-hearted) joke but it really was like that?! As we’ve seen from their collaborations, especially with Black Panther (2018), and for what’s coming next, yes!

Discussing the role of Erik Killmonger, was also described at length. Aside from figuring out what hairstyle he should have and how the body prosthetics were removed each day, Michael expressed what it meant to him to play in such a huge Marvel film. Jenelle asks, “What was the personal thing that drew you to it?” “The personal frustration of being a Black man in America…Unapologetically speak to that. Being part of the African-American diaspora…speak to that disconnect…And then the conversations we had as a cast…other cast members having direct roots from Africa. Having that perspective on their characters…we’re a lot more alike than what we think, taught, than what we’re told.” Caught up in the moment of thinking, Michael pauses several times trying to word what he wants to say in best way.

Jenelle was also happy to point out the film had “such strong female characters…so badass and so in charge…”. He answered that in “Black households, the women, it’s they house…able to take our culture and heritage put on screen, that’s just what our life was like…really fulfilling.” Last Halloween, they had seen “so many little Black Panthers” and Killmongers (with the fake “permanent marker beards” – which made Jenelle crack-up laughing), the Dora Milaje “it was incredible.” And even his telling of something Ryan saw, of seeing a Hispanic family purchase a Black Panther Halloween costume for the young son, “he could be whatever he wants to be, that’s what it’s about, kids growing up with no bias, no real hatred, no animosity, just so innocent. And to be able to have that moment, that symbolism…connect with the story. So specific, so broad, so accessible.”

Before the interview’s end, they had to talk about Michael’s recent step forward as a producer with his company Outlier, and how he made a very public statement he would adopt an Inclusion Rider. Jenelle asked if he “always hope(d) to produce?” “Always. I like putting things together, I like building things…identify people’s strengths, seeing other people win. (Go back to) why all going out for one role? How do you fix that problem, is create more roles and more opportunities.” He’s leaving it to his attorneys for the specific legalese but it’s something that Warner Media will be involved with and other studios will follow along the same path. “It’s a start”.

At the time of their interview, Creed II (2018) was in theatres, and since his projects have included Just Mercy (2019), Netflix's series Raising Dion (2019 to now), and the recently released Amazon Prime Tom Clancy's Without Remorse. As Michael predicted, the third Creed installment is due for next year!

Michelle Yeoh – 2019

Jenelle introduces Michelle Yeoh to the stage saying she “has literally and figuratively been kicking ass on screens premiering as an action star since the 1980s.” Upon getting settled, Jenelle says, “I always like to start by asking, how did you get your SAG card?” While other guests would answer something from working as a child actor, or maybe they’d been Taft-Hartley’d on a project after years working non-union projects, or on a commercial, Michelle spent the first twenty years of her professional career in Asian cinema based in Hong Kong, so she didn’t qualify (or join) until Robert Marshall's Memoirs of a Geisha (2005). Regardless, she is a very proud SAG-AFTRA member saying, “unions and guilds protect rights when necessary” referring to that by the end of a 12-hour workday you “just don’t look good anymore.” Jenelle quickly replied, “I have a feeling you might!” The audience laughed. Michelle recalls that while working on a film in Hong Kong for 7 days straight, she had to choose between showering at an AD’s home nearby, or nap for an hour in a van on set. (*As a member of SAG-AFTRA your minimum working conditions include designated rest periods AND meal periods through your shoot days.)

Changing topics, they discuss how she started out in acting and quickly taking on roles that required her doing stunts, with the same skill as Jackie Chan and Jet Li. Jenelle asked if it happened that way by her “choice or by necessity?” Michelle definitely made the choice to take her career in that direction. In all of the (Asian) films at that time, women played the “damsel-in-distress. Save me!” Even though she didn’t grow up doing martial arts, she was a ballet dancer and very athletic, being physically fit enough to even think of taking on the kinds of stunts her male peers were doing. And she had the confidence to create that kind of female stunt comedic action character; all because those kinds of roles didn’t exist on their own. She told herself, “You deserve a place to be there.” She wasn’t going to “run to a corner and cry. Determined to show we girls can step up to the plate and do all that.” She “transferred one kind of movement to another.” Michelle makes a slight punch motion that Jenelle reacts to as if it were really coming for her, as she’s showing her that you “need to know the space and when be able to go fast but stop.” Michelle had the ability to look like the “girl next door, and suddenly when push comes to shove and I have to defend myself or defend someone I love, just break into this (wha-cha sound) you’re dead man, the element of surprise”.

The interview took a more personal turn when Michelle discussed her growing up, her culture, and her marriage then divorce. She had really supportive parents who always said, “the door is always open. It’s your choice what to do” while most Chinese parents were less likely to seriously consider a child’s career in the arts. With her ex-husband, they had very different ambitions and ideas of family. Though she’d learn she couldn’t have a baby, “no matter how much you love each other you’d hate to look at each other” with disappointment in unfulfilled dreams. Now they are great friends and she is god-mother to his daughter. After their divorce she came out of retirement and returned to acting. Co-starring with Jackie Chan in the terrifically fun Supercop aka Police Story 3 (1992), an audience question about whether they’d work together again, she said they’re trying to find the right project, with Jenelle suggesting, “We haven’t seen Eleanor’s husband yet in Crazy Rich Asians?” Michelle laughs so hard she can’t speak for a moment but then shuts that down, and Jenelle comes back with, “something (instead) where you can punch each other?” “Yeah.” All in good fun like between siblings.

This leads to another audience question, “Do you still practice (martial arts) and still feel you can do your own stunts?” From working on her recent film, Master Z: The Ip Man Legacy (2018) and on the series Star Trek: Discovery (2017), she does her own stunts but no longer “real martial arts…keep flexibility, speed in-tact”. From having done so many stunts without the same level of protections in place as on later projects, she can feel it all coming back to her body, and tries to heal with giving “pep talks to my body everyday” and massages.

Perhaps the funniest moment of their conversation was when Michelle talks about her earliest experiences working in Hollywood. Michelle experienced some unwarranted ignorant comments and the feeling of being treated differently because of her Asian ethnicity. Someone said to her surprised that “Your English is pretty good” to which she clapped-back with, “Yeah, it was a 12-hour flight, so I learned.” How great is that of her to be so bold! She admits though that privately she felt the regular kind of culture shock too of just going from Malaysia and Hong Kong to Los Angeles. She was both happily surprised and also confused to learn the differences there are with Hollywood Blockbuster action flicks; especially noting her work in (James Bond’s) Tomorrow Never Dies (1997). American projects shutdown if someone gets hurt and insurance is incredibly expensive. So there’s a lot at and of risk when a character performer is doing their own stunts. Instead of having to do the action sequences the way she’s used to, even working through injuries, the production brought in a stunt team from Hong Kong to help.

For Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (2000), Michelle talked about how much of a perfectionist Ang Lee is, how she needed to speak Mandarin phonetically instead of doing it in looping sessions later-on (FYI: Michelle actually said ADR but was referring to looping. Per the SAG-AFTRA Basic Agreement, ADR is when a newly hired performer is recording new lines but looping is when an actor is re-recording their own lines). And while discussing Memoirs of a Geisha, Michelle brought up how there needs to be some flexibility between actors of Asian descent because if it’s too strict there’s not as many roles available. Her being Malaysian can’t mean she solely plays Malaysian women. Practicing the nuances of different Asian backgrounds becomes the actor’s job so those details are part of the believed performances. She was incredibly impressed with how the sets for that movie built in Los Angeles were, and “transported (her) back in time to Japan’s post-war era (as) mind-blowing…I love what we do so much because it’s magical!”

Jenelle pressed that topic forward but it opened into an even more elevated conversation about diversity on screen in relation to Danny Boyle’s Sunshine (2007). We learn that Michelle was initially asked to play the commander of their spaceship, but instead at that time in her career chose to play the botanist. She wanted to “explore something a little more understated…an emotional ride more challenging as an actor.” It was however her suggestion that Alex Garland make script changes to reflect that in the future, the astronauts wouldn’t just be Americans and Russians but a multi-racial group, for which the cast would later include Hiroyuki Sanada, Benedict Wong, and other persons of color.

With only about 20 minutes left for their time allotted, they talk about Crazy Rich Asians (2018). A phenomenal summertime hit across the world, Jenelle asks, “Is there anyone who hasn’t seen this movie?” (I've seen it in the theatres at least twice.) And when she asks Michelle, “Were you familiar with the books?” and she was not only familiar but that she and her “friends knew some of these people he was (writing) about.” They also admitted that part of themselves, “I am flashy and I love it. He already had me at the prologue”, referring to when Eleanor walks into the fancy British hotel after getting caught in the rainstorm but being told-off by the racist concierge to instead go to Chinatown, and then how she reacted by taking charge of the situation. “Eleanor is not a character that would scream and shout. To demonstrate power, silence speaks a lot more.” The film story also expresses the “complexities of our culture” and for “Asians from around the world.” She even particularly loved how it was empowering for the women, and what Astrid said to her husband. “It tells a contemporary story supported by the studios, not since The Joy Luck Club (1993)…This is relatable. The impact has been tremendous. I didn’t realize how powerful it was for the audience, to see themselves on screen…Only in the last few years talk inclusivity and diversity. Can’t just be a token. It has to be a full story.”

Nicole Kidman – 2021 

I’m going to call it out right here that this interview didn’t seem to go initially as planned. Their conversation takes a few detours as Nicole goes on perhaps a little too long with some of her answers. At about a third of the way into their conversation, Nicole realizes she’s “jabbering on” but Jenelle is quick to alleviate her momentary self-awareness and self-degradation by saying, “No, no, we’re here to hear you talk!” Saving face and their interview’s tone helps for a bit. Jenelle being the kind moderator she is and respectful of Nicole’s legendary status, does not interrupt, but rather tries her best to guide the conversation back to Nicole focusing on answering her questions. Sometimes without purposeful avoidance, Nicole just doesn't quite catch on to take Jenelle's cues. 

This is the most recent YouTube upload for this blog post study, having been recorded for the Conversations-At-Home series this past Spring. Instead of welcoming the performer to the stage or to the screen, both Jenelle and Nicole appear on camera at the same time. And instead of welcoming a live audience, it is to all the online viewers. In this video-chat format, Jenelle first gives a mini-PSA on the Foundation’s behalf encouraging those who can help to donate to the Covid-19 Relief Fund. Just as Jenelle pivots to the first interview question, Nicole interrupts her with how important that help is and that it’s still an avenue for those in need.

Whatever first question Jenelle was going to ask, Jenelle rolls with Nicole’s enthusiasm. Instead they immediately discuss what it is to be an actor who isn’t working, not because they aren’t getting the role but because the pandemic has either required productions to get additional funds for health & safety or just to delay until this crisis has passed. When making a movie under normal conditions can already take years to get enough financing, Nicole speaks of the empathy she has for performers who need to work on-camera without wearing a mask, and for the producers who make the work environment feel safe enough to do that. “Your taking care of me. You’re not putting me in jeopardy for your own cause.” It should be noted that even with taking the utmost precaution, there were still shutdowns, or despite telling the union(s) of their precautions, many did not actively keep their word for a safe set.

As Jenelle made the good intentioned joke, “if the acting thing doesn’t work out, you have this (producing) to fall back on”. Nicole again interrupts to agree in all seriousness that was exactly why she started producing: turning 40, being pregnant, and sensing her career could go on the decline for those reasons. She wanted to make movies that benefit not just herself but also other women at that same point in their lives who work both behind and in front of the camera.

Bringing the conversation topic back to the beginning of Nicole’s drama education in Australia, Nicole lovingly and independently attended classes on Saturday mornings, started to get work while in high school, and fell behind on homework. She “reluctantly” decided to leave. For many creatives the traditional education isn’t going to fit their needs yet it doesn’t mean they stop learning or studying elsewhere. Even to this day she still upholds that work ethic of research, reading, coming prepared, and even taking refresher acting classes. “I am always a student.” Jenelle was pleasantly surprised to learn this about her, and continued to confirm if she takes the same kind of classes that other (new) actors attend? No. But this opens the next phase of questions not just to Nicole’s movie credits but to a more in-depth discussion about her process, working in ensemble pieces, and being the lead role.

While the actors watching this would be glued to her every word, this might be the point where some regular viewers would get confused. There is almost a secret language among actors when talking about their craft. It’s not just about having chemistry on-screen or practicing your lines, but what it means to prepare; going into the character’s backstory, express a character through their gestures, their subconscious intentions, their motivations, how (and who) they are in relation to the other story’s characters, to trust your scene partner(s), to relax in the moment, and also to approach the lines in different ways. (*A simplified example is watching Nicole play the lead role in Grace of Monaco (2014, currently available on Hulu) at approx. the 22:13 timestamp as Grace Kelly is practicing for Hitchcock’s Marnie (1964) in front of her mirror, saying the lines three different ways.) Nicole talks about how it feels to take credit for a project that does well and blame for when it does not. She was incredibly grateful to work on The Undoing (2021 on HBO Max) with her longtime friend Hugh Grant along with other performers she respects like Lily Rabe and Edgar Ramirez. Jenelle uses that to transition back to the start of Nicole’s American/Hollywood career (referencing Days of Thunder (1990) and Billy Bathgate (1991)) not diving into working on those movies but rather asking the more layered question of “Was it challenging to navigate this new life in a new country in the spotlight?” Not quite answering it directly, Nicole takes it back to her process and method now under the focus of auditioning with those big Hollywood actors. And it was getting their constructive feedback from those auditions she appreciated the most. She uses that experience also towards how she produces when casting roles in her currently produced projects. Knowing it can all “change on a dime” she empathizes with actors struggling day-to-day towards that dream job and then it can take them higher than even they imagined.

By this point in their conversation, Jenelle is again trying to keep the structure as intended. Not that she’s not appreciating what Nicole’s tangents include but they’re not quite on the same page either. Jenelle mentions Nicole’s next set of credits for their comedic performances in To Die For (1995) and her Saturday Night Live (1993) hosting – when cast members included Mike Myers, Adam Sandler, Chris Farley, Phil Hartman, Tim Meadows, and Julia Sweeney). Her memory of working on SNL led to how important her mime acting classes became for her later-on heavy CGI and greenscreen spectacles. Pretending to pet a dog and drink from a teacup became pretending to have a monkey on her shoulder for The Golden Compass (2007).

Jenelle attempts to discuss her working with notable directors, and “what kind of director she hopes for on set?” Nicole appreciates “belief in me…and knowing when they’ve got it (the scene)”. She loves “the obsession…and the commitment.” Jenelle’s immediate response was, “So, Kubrick!” But she was interrupted (again) before getting to discuss Eyes Wide Shut (1999), Nicole continues and Jenelle instead takes the opportunity to talk about Dogville (2003); whether she already knew what would be required of her. Lars von Trier’s Breaking the Waves (1996) stunned her with the kinds of performances he can get from an actor. She was so grateful to be on set with her cast in Sweden but tells of how difficult it was at times, especially having that metal collar around her neck cutting off her windpipe.

Jenelle’s next few questions give Nicole a chance to list some projects she’s proud of but not too many people have seen, like Rabbit Hole (2010), Destroyer (2018), Fur (2006), and The Paperboy (2012). They also briefly spoke about Nicole’s London theatre performance in Photograph 51 (2015) as Rosalind Franklin: the unacknowledged contributor to the discovery of DNA while the other male scientists accepted the Nobel Prize. Then for a significant amount of their remaining allotted time, Nicole discusses how she chooses roles and processes their difficult psyches.

They close on her upcoming projects Nine Perfect Strangers (2021) that will premiere on Hulu this coming summer.

Jake Gyllenhaal – 2013 and then 2016

Although Jenelle has interviewed many celebrities more than once over the course of her career, especially for the Foundation series, there were multiple search results that featured Jake Gyllenhaal. I thought this would be an interesting opportunity to compare her career retrospective interviews with him from 2013 and then 2016. Despite only a three year’s difference, Jake had starred in six released movies within that time. As much as Jenelle could have covered in 2013, she’d be able to do a whole other hour just on those six roles in 2016. From watching these two interviews back-to-back some of the same questions from the first were asked again in the second. I don’t think it’s because she didn’t remember what she asked in the first but because she knew it’d be a wholly different live audience attending looking to hear similar questions answered. It just so happened that Jake’s answers had slightly changed because of his own growth, reflection, reconsideration, and rephrasing.

Additionally, it should be noted that how Jake looked and behaved in 2013 versus 2016 were practically night-and-day. For the former, his interview was just hours after wrapping Nightcrawler (2014) running on only 4 hours of sleep. The project required a lot of night shoots, a gaunt appearance (that he may have tried to hide with what I think is a light spray tan?) and portraying an intense character with nefarious intentions as a news outlet’s crime story videographer. But in the latter, he’s much more rested, alert, and playing with the conversation’s humorous moments. Rather it was Jenelle in 2016 who maybe didn’t get enough sleep because her usual ability to recall movie titles, their stars, directors, etc. were sometimes misspoken or mistaken. Hey look, embarrassing moments happen to even the best of professionals and since these two were already well acquainted with each other, it became a running joke between them even to the end of the interview, making for a really entertaining show!

Rather than go through their 2013 interview and then their 2016 interview, I’m going to highlight some of the similarities and differences from the first parts of each interview, and then note some of the interesting moments.

When Jenelle introduces Jake on stage in 2013, she says, “This is someone who before the age of 30 established himself as not just one of the best actors of his generation but of any generation.” In 2016, she says, “This is an actor who has been showing his range in everything from (list of movie credits), ever the over-achiever, he is actually on screen in two amazing movies this year playing three very riveting roles (referring to Nocturnal Animals (2016) and something else)…”. The first is more serious while the second is more banter but both are very complimentary to his talent and career of work.

For both, her first (planned) questions relates to how young he started acting but are differently phrased. In 2013, it’s “How did you get your SAG card?” While in 2016, it’s “I’m curious, what was your first job in the business?” Though they are similar, what qualified him for his SAG card may not have yielded the same answer as what his first acting job was. Jake confirmed in both of his answers it was his role in City Slickers (1991) playing Billy Crystal’s son but what details he spoke of were not exactly the same. In 2013, he emphasizes his mom on-set and telling him he’d be getting “what’s called a SAG card” but he didn’t fully comprehend what that professionally meant. “Now at 32 I’ve had my SAG card” ever since. In 2016 he instead spoke about his audition, working in Montana, and having his dad with him (too).

Then in both interviews, she asks him about his decision to continue working as an actor as more of a career than just something he did as a kid. In 2013, it was a very detailed conversation of itself but in 2016 she used his 2013 answer like a springboard to go further into that mindset. He’s had some additional thoughts between their conversations.

2013

Jenelle: …your father is a very well-respected director, your mother is a screenwriter, was it a foregone conclusion you’d be an actor or work in the industry or rebel against it?

Jake: Yes, it was a foregone conclusion, there was a lot of acting going on at the dinner table. I have a very intense sister (the audience laughs, knowing he’s referring to the also revered Maggie Gyllenhaal) she was acting before I was…you feel it in your bones you want to do it too because you look up to her…(and from having very supportive parents). People have asked me that before and I can never be quite sure.

Jenelle: At what point did you decide ‘I want to do that for the rest of my life?’ Or have you?

Jake: Most of us we don’t have the opportunity to start at 11 years old…they start at 30…I wasn’t quite sure but knew it was extraordinary but didn’t really find out why ‘til last year.

Jenelle: Was it the movies you were doing or something internally?

Jake: Both. I decided to approach in a different way. I felt my life was growing more seriously…number of things in my life…I moved to New York (City)…The six months of prep informed my life and the 22 days we shot that movie (End of Watch (2012)) was a blip.

2016

Jenelle: You’ve said it was a while before you really knew that acting was what you wanted to do as a career, was there a turning point (a movie or a role)?

Jake: I always say I don’t really know if it is, but that’s the feeling of the horror and don’t know if allowed to keep doing it, so the moment I think I knew when I watched my sister work when I was a kid (joke about South Pacific musical theatre)…I don’t know if I have really…I really love watching acting more than I love acting myself, I love being across from a great actor…there’s who those want to command that space and there’s who want to listen (he prefers the latter). It’s hard for me to do it alone…I’m just usually not as good as they are.”

Jenelle: So we’re probably not gonna see a one-man show from you anytime soon…

Jake: Nah, my one-man show is next week…Whoever said I have to tell the truth up here!

(Audience laughs.)

From watching the rest of the 2013 interview, there’s an extended discussion of how Jake played Detective Loki in Prisoners (2013) opposite Hugh Jackman. He says that a lot of preparation went into playing him; that despite how mysterious or enigmatic he looked and behaved, he wanted to still be clearly defined in those looks and behaviors. “I wanted to give them (the audience) something, while I’m asking questions, they’re asking questions of him.” If you think about Jake’s roles over his career, that’s very much the point from which he seems to work outwards from. He is so good, expressing so many emotions and thoughts with just a look but then it just also happens he has lines to speak too. From just giving that look, wearing whatever hair and costume he’s got on, then emerges a tone in his voice and a few gestures to match. The film stories he tells have a gripping dramatic nature. Part of why Donnie Darko (2001) was his breakout role is because even though on the surface it has a confusing narrative, multiple viewings reveal it’s more about the characters’ inner turmoil than what is happening in the plot. This is something Jenelle repeats without realizing it but Jake does: “I feel like this is becoming a theme. ‘I don’t understand what your character was doing or what he is, but I really like it, I have no idea what that movie was about but I like it.”

Through his 2013 interview, his answers are like he is exploring and explaining the very nature of acting and his thoughts about it but can’t quite put it succinctly. I have the idea that he’s been long philosophizing on acting itself yet on only 4 hours of sleep he might have lost track and ended up on a few detours trying to get back there on his own. (Similarly to how Nicole may have gotten lost in her thoughts, he goes on a bit longer than realizes. Their wisdom just can't be contained.)

He also took the opportunity for humor, making a friendly reference to James Franco’s character in Spring Breakers (2012) when Jenelle mentioned that when she recently interviewed James all he wanted was to talk about Jake’s career. Or, later on, when Jenelle asks him, “…are you still learning new things about acting?” Jake retorts, “No, I’ve learned everything there is to know!” He then wound it back to answer with a piece of advice Dustin Hoffman had for him: “You know you don’t have to do so much…Just deliver the pizza.”

Towards the back third of their 2013 and 2016 interviews, Jenelle asked him one of her go-to questions, “What is it you hope from a director when you show up to a set?”

2013

Jake: I don’t think I have any consistent want…you just do what they say, they see something, and you’re in their movie, whatever they want from you don’t fight it so hard, because in the end it’s their movie, it’s their story…if something seems really stupid or you’re compromised then fight for yourself or your character…you just want to be believed in, even if you’re pushed to a level that’s hard to believe…when there is something that is so good you just want to do everything, respect the story they’re telling and they have to respect what you do.

2016

Jake: Hopefully you have a relationship before that. Hope for belief in me. They know they don’t have to worry about me…Love someone who gives me room, figuratively and the space to explore. A few takes. 

There’s an audience question Jenelle asks to push the topic further, of if he’d prefer less or more takes. He talks about a director like David Fincher, it’s not just about the actors’ performances in the foreground but the full frame. And getting what you need to choose from. “I will do 1000 takes if I know why. If we’re on a search for something together. It’s maddening when you don’t understand why.”

In their 2016 interview, Jenelle took the opportunity to ask him about his career’s work on stage. In 2002 he was in Kenneth Lonergan’s London performance of This Is Our Youth with Anna Paquin and Hayden Christensen. Doing this play was around the same time as he’d worked on The Good Girl and Lovely & Amazing; all roles that required him to take acting seriously and not as they say ‘phone it in’. “That play came to me, just jumped in without knowing anything.” At some point he said he got a bit of stage fright and got support to recover. According to his International Broadway Database page of credits, his American work started in 2015 with Constellations and then in 2017 with Sunday in the Park with George. “Five days rehearsal and then perform four times for 3000 people. Crash course and now you’re on Broadway (using his voice to add effect as if he’s just been pushed onto the stage). It’s a reading but it’s staged. Like the nightmare we all have. This is the actual, I am living this nightmare.” Despite the incredible pressure that performance required, he was happy not to do it alone, that professional stage actress Annaleigh Ashford was there with him, “when you feel like you’re part of something and working together, very little fear. I talk about being nervous and intimidated but I love it, bring it on!” He continues that from doing Southpaw (2015), he started popping his shoulders like “going into the ring” before starting a scene.

In the 2016 interview, as I mentioned above, there were a few flubs that they both kept running the joke upon. So here’s what happened and why you need to see it play out in the video:

Jake was talking about getting the role in Donnie Darko because another actor had to drop out, and that actor still “intimidates” him. It surprised Jenelle and she asked, “Really, that’s so interesting because I know your costar in Prisoners Hugh Grant” but Jake corrects her, “Hugh Jackman”. There’s laughs from the audience, and Jenelle can’t stop laughing at herself for making that mistake, with her head in her hands, blushing. “Wooow…I can’t believe I just said that?!” And then Jake continues by impersonating Hugh Grant in Hugh Jackman’s role. There’s more laughs, and Jake says, “This is the best Q&A I’ve ever done!” She replies, “Because I’m an idiot”. She recovers her composure, and they move on. But some time later, there is a joke about Hugh Laurie. And Jenelle says she confused the two Hughs because the “last person I sat across from was Hugh Grant. You know my schedule. I’m going to use that as my excuse.” Jake says, “You are a very busy woman.” And then she kindly retorts, “Not as busy as you are.” Later on, they are discussing Jake’s role in Stronger (2017) playing Jeff Bauman, who was a victim in the Boston Marathon bombing. But she asks him meeting Jeff for the movie Patriot’s Day (2016 with Mark Wahlberg), but Jake had to correct her again. “I’m on a roll” she says.

Among the stories you can hear in these interviews that are likely not available in any other interview or with as much detail include how Jake was willingly tased by cops while preparing for End of Watch, how he got the role in Donnie Darko, how future Oscar nominee Riz Ahmed’s audition for Nightcrawler was so impressive the role was re-written for his ethnicity, his normal growing up, working on Brokeback Mountain (2005) with Ang Lee and Heath Ledger, looking for character motivation running from the mega wave in The Day After Tomorrow (2004), and still being able to recite lines from Nightcrawler years later. (There’s also an endearing joke Jake embarrasses Jenelle with involving Tom Ford and some flowers!)

Jenelle and Jake are due for another career retrospective, now five years later to discuss his producing projects, and roles since 2016 like: Okja, Wildlife, The Sisters Brothers, Velvet Buzzsaw, and Spiderman: Far From Home. As well as playing himself in the Netflix comedy musical variety special John Mulaney & the Sack Lunch Bunch. 

 CONCLUSION:

What I have always found so valuable watching these celebrity interviews is how much you can learn about the entertainment industry by just listening to the people in it. Forget about the gossip pages, the social media posts, and the E! News clips. Those outlets only give you a fantasized idea of what it means to be a famous actor. These career retrospective series, and even a 20minute Q&A between an actor and an entertainment journalist shows the viewer a window into the actual world of being a human in the spotlight; and even if it’s fun, it’s still work.

From watching all of these YouTube extended celebrity interviews, there was a handful of typical questions, and a defined intention for structure. The most straightforward was Leo DiCaprio's, going from A to Z without much hiccup. Some have some surprises in store. Some interviews don’t always go as planned but Jenelle is able to take those moments in stride.

On a separate note, you might notice similarities between guests’ answers. Whether it’s how they approach their work, how they’ve learned to transition from child to veteran actor, and what they experience on set.

A most interesting aspect watching these was how guests couldn’t help impersonate those they were reminiscing about or how they would become more animated when recalling personal memories. There are blink-and-you’ll-miss-it moments when Leo DiCaprio impersonates those lauded Hollywood legends Scorsese, DeNiro, and Day Lewis. He’s worked with them so often for long periods that he can nail their distinguished gestures and voices, but he can do so without (a) making fun of them or (b) not get raked for doing them. Michelle Yeoh impersonates a friend of hers at a dinner meeting and also how Jackie Chan was when they first met on set. She also tried to sound like how Nora Lum aka Awkwafina laughs. And Jake acts out an imagined version of Tom Ford.

Additionally, something I noticed was that in each of these retrospectives, certain titles were not included in the conversation. Not only was there not enough time to discuss ALL of the guests’ credits but I think that when in the greenroom before going out on stage, some titles had to be agreed upon not to speak about. We’ve all got something on our résumés we’d rather forget or omit. Here, that is probably Leo DiCaprio’s The Man in the Iron Mask (1998), Jake Gyllenhaal’s Bubble Boy (2001), and Nicole Kidman’s Far and Away (1992) among other Tom Cruise collaborations. (I doubt I’m the only one who would like to hear more about Jake’s hair choice as Jimmy Livingston in the same way Michael B. Jordan decided on Killmonger’s locks? Haha!)

Jenelle Riley interviews are like moderated actors’ mini-master classes. She’s a fan who interviews her favorites without “bullshit” questions. She doesn’t seem to mind the long days, the research, and her busy schedule because she is truly passionate. And those she talks to appreciate her detailed questions, and the space to answer them.